Serious question: Has anyone ever...

[pillaka]

'06 I had 4 off bike excursions, 2 of them being my worst 3 so far. Including totaling a brand new R6.

This year 2 not so bad ones and one 1 stupid one, at the beave I did manage to steer away from the armco, but had a tough time getting that bike to just go straight across bumpy wet grass. Comparing the severity of the crashes in '06 to '07 and factoring in that I was on the track even more this year I'd say I'm on the road to improvement.

Off the top of my head I can't say how many, but I can say that each and every one of them was 100% my fault. It's a learning process, I'm not out there to crash, I hate it, but nobody is perfect, we all make mistakes. I got a pretty good idea of the events that consistently take place on the bike and in my head each and every time leading up to a crash to avoid putting myself into an OSS (Oh shit situation), cause in an OSS you're instincts do take over, and are probably going to tell you the complete OPPOSITE of what to do. Fear takes over and you either freeze up or your brain thinks a logical solution to an illogical situation which in fact causes you to crash. Thankfully the more experience and knowledge you gain, the more you can kinda reprogram yourself to do the correct thing in an OSS but most importantly avoid them all together. Rubber tires grip a lot better than frame sliders and metal.

[ffejtable]

I dont know about most of you guys, but I am not an experienced rider, especially when it comes to emergency situations, or OSS as stiffy likes to call them.

As he said instincts do tend to take over... Honestly if I have a choice of bailing "safely" id probably wind up doing that. If I can lay the bike down and slide, I'll take my chances with that.

[Kennedy]

Originally Posted by ffejtable

I dont know about most of you guys, but I am not an experienced rider, especially when it comes to emergency situations, or OSS as stiffy likes to call them.

As he said instincts do tend to take over... Honestly if I have a choice of bailing "safely" id probably wind up doing that. If I can lay the bike down and slide, I'll take my chances with that.

Every crash I've had I have somehow tried to save it and I would never purposely dump my bike unless I knew I was going to crash...and by that time Im already scrapping elbow hip and probably other things but I'm with it until the ship sinks 99.99999% of the time.

Numerous times I've almost lowsided and I managed to save it twice via my knee once a pocono and another time at beaver. The other times I stood the bike up or just gave it more gas to reduce the load on the front. However when I do lowside I will fight until the bike is seperated from me to get it back on track.

There are always those freak accidents where you just might have to jump ship.

[CBRBob]

Originally Posted by ffejtable

As he said instincts do tend to take over... Honestly if I have a choice of bailing "safely" id probably wind up doing that. If I can lay the bike down and slide, I'll take my chances with that.

So when you were following me down the hill at Beaver, do you think "throwing it down" would have been better than what I did?

[ffejtable]

Originally Posted by Kennedy

Every crash I've had I have somehow tried to save it and I would never purposely dump my bike unless I knew I was going to crash...and by that time Im already scrapping elbow hip and probably other things but I'm with it until the ship sinks 99.99999% of the time.

Numerous times I've almost lowsided and I managed to save it twice via my knee once a pocono and another time at beaver. The other times I stood the bike up or just gave it more gas to reduce the load on the front. However when I do lowside I will fight until the bike is seperated from me to get it back on track.

There are always those freak accidents where you just might have to jump ship.

I think thats my point, and part of Ron's original question.. There comes a time where you are in over your head and a decision needs to be made wether to hang on, or to let go. For everybody the time to make this decision is going to be different. The moment I feel I am unable to save it and lowsiding is an option, I will go that route. I've only gone down a few times, and they have been all lowsides, and for my skill none of them I could have recovered from.

Lets take one of my accidents as an example... Cold and new tires, took a jughandle too fast and the rear slides out on me. 100% rider error. Assuming I could have even saved it, by the time even an experienced rider put the bike back upright enough to stop they would have already blown through a stop sign and into an intersection. I'll take sliding 20ft or so and some roadrash over being run over by cross traffic anyday. For me trying to save it didnt even cross my mind, which fortunately was probably the right decision anyway.

Originally Posted by CBRBob

So when you were following me down the hill at Beaver, do you hink "throwing it down" would have been better than what I did?

YES! Just kidding... You never lost control of your bike from what I can tell, so there was no reason to even consider trying to recover.. There was simply nothing to recover from. I don't think thats the kind of situation Ron is referring to.

"Unfortunately" for me, I have not really had that many Oh crap situations, other than the crashes I did have. I can't really say I bailed on any of them, since once the bike hits the pavement I consider it beyond the point of return and at that point I let go of the bike.

[CBRBob]

Originally Posted by ffejtable

YES! Just kidding... You never lost control of your bike from what I can tell, so there was no reason to even consider trying to recover.. There was simply nothing to recover from.

Well, I was 15mph faster than the guy and his bike lowsiding in front of me with nowhere to go. I knew I was going on/over/through he and his bike. I could have purposely crashed() so I wouldn't get near him. But I stayed on the brake(even on grass), and steered right between where he and the bike were. All I had to show for it was some glove marks on my lower fairing.

[Brian78]

this isnt a 'serious question'.. its called ur bored as fuck and have nothing better to do than ask the same fuckin retarded question on 2 different sites.

[Smokes35]

Originally Posted by RCM78

Not true.
It's amazing how your mind can slow things down. I've avoided MANY crashes at very high speeds by using some skill, experience and good ole fashioned dumb luck.

Simply "laying it down" is NOT an option.

Dont let him fool you... Ralph more often than not either scolds whatevers in his way into getting out of the way... or destroys whatevers in the way with his lazer eyes.

If that dosent work, he smashes through it with all his brawn.

[JHuff1219]

Not sure if this helps but I have a scenerio which I think exemplifies the original question and happens to be based upon a real-life incident:

Rider is going through a right-hand corner at speed (45-50 mph) leaned over knee not on the ground but the rider is positioned correctly. Just beyond the apex is a car "backing" out of a driveway and blocking both lanes as the driver intends to continue in the same direction as the rider. The driver's vision was partially blocked by a large tree along the inside of the turn and the driver is elderly so the driver's hearing may have been impaired.

What do you do as the rider? (and remember the closing distance between the bike and car leaves the rider with about one-half second to make the proper choice which equates to roughly 50 feet)

Some choices:
A) Grab front brakes-could induce low-side if the lean-angle is not increased.
B) Jump on the back brake-could induce high-side if lean-angle is not increased.
C) Hit both brakes equally-stopping distance may not allow rider to avoid contact with the auto but could allow for a controlled exit from the road surface.
D) Leap from the motorcycle just before contact and take your chances sliding from the road surface.
E) Other: (post another alternative and I will provide information on whether your atlernative would have been possible)

[High_Revs_17]

Exactly, it isn't, my focus is more on after the fact when control IS lost.

Thanks for the great examples Jeff.

Originally Posted by ffejtable

You never lost control of your bike from what I can tell, so there was no reason to even consider trying to recover.. There was simply nothing to recover from. I don't think thats the kind of situation Ron is referring to.

[RCM78]

Originally Posted by JHuff1219

Not sure if this helps but I have a scenerio which I think exemplifies the original question and happens to be based upon a real-life incident:

Rider is going through a right-hand corner at speed (45-50 mph) leaned over knee not on the ground but the rider is positioned correctly. Just beyond the apex is a car "backing" out of a driveway and blocking both lanes as the driver intends to continue in the same direction as the rider. The driver's vision was partially blocked by a large tree along the inside of the turn and the driver is elderly so the driver's hearing may have been impaired.

What do you do as the rider? (and remember the closing distance between the bike and car leaves the rider with about one-half second to make the proper choice which equates to roughly 50 feet)

Some choices:
A) Grab front brakes-could induce low-side if the lean-angle is not increased.
B) Jump on the back brake-could induce high-side if lean-angle is not increased.
C) Hit both brakes equally-stopping distance may not allow rider to avoid contact with the auto but could allow for a controlled exit from the road surface.
D) Leap from the motorcycle just before contact and take your chances sliding from the road surface.
E) Other: (post another alternative and I will provide information on whether your atlernative would have been possible)

I choose E.
Stand the bike up quickly and get on the brakes for all there worth. If a collision is iminent I will hit the car at a much slower speed then low siding into it.

[CBRBob]

Originally Posted by High_Revs_17

my focus is more on after the fact when control IS lost.

If control is lost, you have no say in what is happening to you. So choosing to 'crash to avoid a crash' makes less than zero sense.

As for the choices.... C seems the best, with Ralph's 'stand it up, then get on the brakes' style of braking.

[causef0rconcern]

I've had similar things happen to me...going around a blind right hander at maybe 45 or 50. Not scraping knee but just about. Right there past the apex is a car stopped in my lane waiting to turn left, because there is a a car coming towards me in the oncoming lane, forcing the car in my lane to wait till they pass so they can complete their turn. So both lanes are blocked at the exit of the turn, and I'm accelerating for my exit. My only options are to hammer the brakes, which would NOT have stopped me in time..I would have either endo'd into the back window of the car stopped, or just hit it straight in the ass while braking. I could have "thrown it down" and slid around somewhere, or option 3 which I chose was to hit the throttle all the way and just shoot right inbetween the two cars on the double yellow. Which was extremely dangerous, because if the car waiting to turn left did, I would have been wiped. Luckily, I made it, but since then I am extremely nervous on my backroad twisty days. Not worth it. I can't believe I'm still alive after all the dumb crap I've almost died doing on my bike. Save up and wait for track.

[Kennedy]

Originally Posted by causef0rconcern

I've had similar things happen to me...going around a blind right hander at maybe 45 or 50. Not scraping knee but just about. Right there past the apex is a car stopped in my lane waiting to turn left, because there is a a car coming towards me in the oncoming lane, forcing the car in my lane to wait till they pass so they can complete their turn. So both lanes are blocked at the exit of the turn, and I'm accelerating for my exit. My only options are to hammer the brakes, which would NOT have stopped me in time..I would have either endo'd into the back window of the car stopped, or just hit it straight in the ass while braking. I could have "thrown it down" and slid around somewhere, or option 3 which I chose was to hit the throttle all the way and just shoot right inbetween the two cars on the double yellow. Which was extremely dangerous, because if the car waiting to turn left did, I would have been wiped. Luckily, I made it, but since then I am extremely nervous on my backroad twisty days. Not worth it. I can't believe I'm still alive after all the dumb crap I've almost died doing on my bike. Save up and wait for track.

And here I was thinking you'd have to crash before you realized that the track is the best place for the twistys my man.

If you love getting low, get to the track period.

[CBRBob]

It's ok to bail if this happens..........