The Helmet Story

[PitsVtec]

We all spoke to the Arai rep about testing the biscuit's helmet after his crash. The guy said if you suffer any brain trauma, concussion, memory loss, etc. Arai doesn't need to test it b/c the helmet is no longer good. I accept the fact that Arai and Shoei are good helmets, and expensive....but I crashed in a HJC, and didn't have any of the above issues. I know that HJC is one of the cheaper brands, but I just found that interesting. He asked me what kind of helmet I've got now and I told him a Scorpion and he said granted that's a $200.00 helmet you can give it to us and we'll give you about $75.00-$100.00 of credit towards an Arai. I was like I just bought this helmet, it's unlikely that I'm going to burn the difference in the money by giving it to you for an Arai...I also found interesting (although I've been told this before) that if you drop a helmet just once, from about 2-3 feet from the ground it's no longer good b/c the foam gets compressed and doesn't offer as much protection. That seems realistic, but at the same time upsetting. When Mark crashed my helmet fell off my mirror and now I'm supposed to believe that it's not good anymore.....WTF???

[Cakes206]

Yes, dropping a helmet can render a helmet usless.

Helmet damage can occur in a sporting accident, or when the helmet is not in place on a your head, for example if it is dropped onto concrete from several feet. For this reason, manufacturers and government authorities instruct users to either return the helmet to the factory for inspection, or discard the helmet, if it has seen a significant impact. You should see a label to this effect inside your helmet.

Pretty neat idea:
http://www.hyperlites.com/shokspotr.htm

[Kurts1000RR]

I've got now and I told him a Scorpion and he said granted that's a $200.00 helmet you can give it to us and we'll give you about $75.00-$100.00 of credit towards an Arai. I was like I just bought this helmet, it's unlikely that I'm going to burn the difference in the money by giving it to you for an Arai...

Ive got an Arai and a Scorpion. The Scorpion actually beat the Arai in some tests and overall scored pretty much the same. I actually like my Scorpion better and wear it much more often. Stick with it.

....if you drop a helmet just once, from about 2-3 feet from the ground it's no longer good b/c the foam gets compressed and doesn't offer as much protection.

Ive heard it both ways. On the other side of the coin Ive heard if the exterior is undaunted then your fine. Who knows.

[RonJ83]

yea there was an article on helmets the the ratings go DOT>BSI>Snell. but id go with BSI only cause its accually a testing system to make sure all the helmets meet the requirements, unlike DOT which is an honor system. im not that trusting. as for the helmet falling and rendering it useless i think thats a load of bull, i dropped my helmet a couple of time and that time i got in a crash it held up just fine, given that its useless now (inside styro is cracked) it still did its job.

[Cakes206]

as for the helmet falling and rendering it useless i think thats a load of bull

Not saying it will always be the case...but there is always definite possibility depending on what kind of impact...many different variables to factor.

[Kurts1000RR]

...but there is always definite possibility depending on what kind of impact...many different variables to factor.

Your noggins not worth risking either way. :nuts:

[Rev]

yea there was an article on helmets the the ratings go DOT>BSI>Snell. but id go with BSI only cause its accually a testing system to make sure all the helmets meet the requirements, unlike DOT which is an honor system. im not that trusting. as for the helmet falling and rendering it useless i think thats a load of bull, i dropped my helmet a couple of time and that time i got in a crash it held up just fine, given that its useless now (inside styro is cracked) it still did its job.

ron...I don't think it's b.s. If you drop your helemt and the impact is hard enough...it could suffer a minor hairline fracture..that hairline fracture can get bigger due to weather..cold and hot weathers may cause it to expand and contract...

We really can't tell how bad crystal's helmet is...i don't know..to me it's just a fact that i believe you get what you pay for....If HJC or scorpian have really top of the line quality..y not charge and compete with arai and shoei? quality is quality...and it cost money..just like any other item...ie: computers, cars, electronics, etc etc...

Granted crystal's hjc helmet did her justice..but who's to say her crash wasn't as severe as say someone who fell off the bike doing 25 mph head first into the concrete...i'm sure crystal doesn't remember how she fell...

Crystal it's really up to you if you wanna get a new helmet...you know how I am..for safety I would get a new one...You saw first had what a blow to the head could do...and it could have been worse...

[High_Revs_17]

If you drop your helemt and the impact is hard enough...it could suffer a minor hairline fracture..that hairline fracture can get bigger due to weather..cold and hot weathers may cause it to expand and contract...

CORRECT! That's the main reason why a helmet should be replaced after it has been dropped from either a standing position at 4 feet, or more so from a wreck at any speed which is much more substantial regarding the impact. Helmets are designed to have tiny crumple zones like a car so if a rider was to fall from a sitting idle postion with their head being about 4 feet off the ground the helmet would compress inside and out in order to absorb the G forces experienced by the rider's head...this is tested documented info. from SNELL! That's how sensative helmets are, they aren't like suits of armor that can withstand impacts with brick walls without being damaged.

One hairline crack can lead to a webing effect causing a major portion of the helmet to be useless in the event of an impact. These fractures cannot be seen by the naked eye and are often located within the underlayers of the helmet's laminant structure. A helmet relies on it's entire structure as a unibody system, and if one part of that system fails, the entire system fails.

In my accident my head bounced and skidded on the ground for a bit at over 60mph and the HJC did it's job well, but that doesn't mean I'm going to think of using it again. When it comes to your head use your brain people, get a new lid cuz you're going to need that brain for a while.

[Cakes206]

ron...I don't think it's b.s. If you drop your helemt and the impact is hard enough...it could suffer a minor hairline fracture..that hairline fracture can get bigger due to weather..cold and hot weathers may cause it to expand and contract...

Not only that, but dropping the helmet can rupture a helmet's internal impact system(different manufaturers call it something different) wich is good for one shot and one shot only...almost like a mini airbag system within the helmet if you will...(from what I was told) depending on the helmet if you look inside under the lining if the white styrofoam part turns black in any given area, then it ruptured and its time for a new helmet.

[RonJ83]

i know what you guys are saying but im telling you i dropped my helmet a couple of times before i got into that accident, there is a crack in my helmet now from the accident but it held up and prevent my noggin from being split, i wrote to arai and shoei and neither has responded. i also spoke to a couple of people who race and they told me that dropping a helmet is common and if everyone had to replace it everytime they drop it helmet prices wouldnt be so high.

[PitsVtec]

...i'm sure crystal doesn't remember how she fell...


Fuck wrong......I remember all of it.....Goooosh Mark! You were there to see me get up and you were able to speak to me.......don't you remember!:ohmygod:

[PitsVtec]

And my issue is that my helmet fell from my bike and bounced about 2 times. There's a small knick in the back, but the face shield took the damage.

[High_Revs_17]

i dropped my helmet a couple of times before i got into that accident, there is a crack in my helmet now from the accident but it held up and prevent my noggin from being split,...a couple of people who race and they told me that dropping a helmet is common and if everyone had to replace it everytime they drop it helmet prices wouldnt be so high.

That's the problem, the majority of motorcyclists don't seem to know and/or understand the facts stated in this thread, therefore they don't replace them after being dropped. I know a few people using helmets that have clearly been damaged regarding exposed underlayers from road rash :ohmygod:, but riding's like playing poker, if you choose to go all in you never know if you'll come out with all your chips...

[Rev]

Fuck wrong......I remember all of it.....Goooosh Mark! You were there to see me get up and you were able to speak to me.......don't you remember!:ohmygod:


silly poopy doopy hoopy..i meant what kind of impact your helmet took while you were rolling down the highway, that you don't know how you "rolled" i guess we can say ...i know how you fell...duh.

[CBRBob]

A few things. Don't ever put your helmet on the seat, mirror etc. Put it on the ground, it can't fall off! Or put it on the helmet lock on the bike. Treat it as if your head is in it, always! Get a new one at least every 4 or 5 years regardless of how perfect it looks.

[Cakes206]

Put it on the ground, it can't fall off!

What if the earth suddenly stoped spinning?

(say that 5 times fast :lol: )

[PitsVtec]

silly poopy doopy hoopy..i meant what kind of impact your helmet took while you were rolling down the highway, that you don't know how you "rolled" i guess we can say ...i know how you fell...duh.


Of course I know how I fell and rolled. The initial impact didn't come from my head hitting the ground first...it was on my knee and hand hitting the ground, then the gash on my helmet came at the point when I started rolling...

[PitsVtec]

What if the earth suddenly stoped spinning?

(say that 5 times fast :lol: )


Are you having a blonde moment?

[RonJ83]

That's the problem, the majority of motorcyclists don't seem to know and/or understand the facts stated in this thread, therefore they don't replace them after being dropped. I know a few people using helmets that have clearly been damaged regarding exposed underlayers from road rash :ohmygod:, but riding's like playing poker, if you choose to go all in you never know if you'll come out with all your chips...


o no if i see it damaged im definitely replacing it like the Arai that i have. its my noggin we're talkin about and i dont want to take any chances. but a simple fall from 2-4 ft shouldnt be so exaggerated.

Or put it on the helmet lock on the bike.

thats how i dropped mine twice, tryin to get the d-rings into the clamp thing and the helmet slips out my hands. i was told to stop puttin the helmet on the floor because it symbolizes that a rider went down. *i dunno, i just dont do it anymore*

[CBRBob]

o no if i see it damaged im definitely replacing it like the Arai that i have. its my noggin we're talkin about and i dont want to take any chances. but a simple fall from 2-4 ft shouldnt be so exaggerated.

thats how i dropped mine twice, tryin to get the d-rings into the clamp thing and the helmet slips out my hands. i was told to stop puttin the helmet on the floor because it symbolizes that a rider went down. *i dunno, i just dont do it anymore*

There can be damage you don't see.

If you keep dropping your helmet while putting it on the helmet lock you need to start taking your meds again :nod2:

The helmet on the ground means a rider needs assistance. When you place it on the white line of the roadway (essentially asking for your helmet to be destroied by oncoming cagers). So, put your helmet on the dround next to your bike, which should be well away from traffic :wave2:

[RonJ83]

If you keep dropping your helmet while putting it on the helmet lock you need to start taking your meds again :nod2:

i never needed meds lol, its cause i have a gi-normous head *you can ask anyone that has met me* and on top of that i always drop it cause i have textbooks and crap between my arms and its a bitch, im sure i wont drop it anymore seeing that now i have a school bag LOL

[Kurts1000RR]

The helmet on the ground means a rider needs assistance.....

And remember, the helmet on the bar means your buying the bar a round! :boogie:

[High_Revs_17]

Put it on the ground, it can't fall off!

The rider won't be too happy when the newly established ant colony that crawled into their helmet starts to make a new home in their hair just as they hit the twisties. :lol:

[High_Revs_17]

im sure i wont drop it anymore seeing that now i have a school bag LOL

How many times? :eek:

[RonJ83]

How many times? :eek:

i dropped my arai about 8x i think, all of them due to the fact i was tryin to carry too many textbooks and late for class

[High_Revs_17]

i dropped my arai about 8x i think

Dude...I'm not trying to bust your balls, but get rid of it. :ohmygod:

[RonJ83]

Dude...I'm not trying to bust your balls, but get rid of it. :ohmygod:

i know youre not im tryin to get a chainsaw to split it in half, im going to order a new lid next season, but right now all the money is being put into the bike itself and my tuition :lol:

[CBRBob]

Drive your car over it :)

[FigNewTon]

This is the one piece of gear that can truly save your life...is it really worth the chance?

[RonJ83]

Drive your car over it :)


anyone have a truck?:roflmao:

[High_Revs_17]

Now I'm getting curious, it's time for a little myth busting! Think I'll hit my old helmet with different objects starting with a hammer, then maybe drop it from the second floor window, hmmmmm......

[Rev]

Now I'm getting curious, it's time for a little myth busting! Think I'll hit my old helmet with different objects starting with a hammer, then maybe drop it from the second floor window, hmmmmm......


we should contact myth busters about this....

[RCM78]

If you drop your helmet, the section that hits the ground will become compacted. The material used to absorbe energy in a helmet will not reexpand. Once it is crushed thats it. That means the one section of the helmet that has been crushed will no longer protect you in a crash. So if you do crash make sure you dont hit your head in that spot.

Multiple drops just make it worse.

Hanging a helmet on your mirror can cause two problems:
1. It will fall off and drop about 4-5 feet.
2. Everytime you hang the helmet on the mirror you slightly crush the material used to absorb energy in a crash. Slowly rendering the helmet useless.

Like Bob said, The proper place for your helmet is on the ground next to your bike. I put mine right behind the front wheel...

[ffejtable]

If you drop your helmet, the section that hits the ground will become compacted. The material used to absorbe energy in a helmet will not reexpand. Once it is crushed thats it. That means the one section of the helmet that has been crushed will no longer protect you in a crash. So if you do crash make sure you dont hit your head in that spot.

Multiple drops just make it worse.

Hanging a helmet on your mirror can cause two problems:
1. It will fall off and drop about 4-5 feet.
2. Everytime you hang the helmet on the mirror you slightly crush the material used to absorb energy in a crash. Slowly rendering the helmet useless.

Like Bob said, The proper place for your helmet is on the ground next to your bike. I put mine right behind the front wheel...

Because im afaid of those ever fearful ant colonies making my helmet their new home I just use the D-rings to hang it from the left passenger peg... Off the ground and its not likely to slip off, either... The grooves on the peg prevent the D-ring from sliding...

As for dropping it 8 times and not replacing it... Hey its your head, I am not going to preach to you about it, but I think if you are spendning money on bike "upgrades" before replacing what is very likely a useless helmet, you have some seriously distorted priorities... Bike upgrades wont do you much good if you are a vegetable and can't ride it next season.

[Kaos]

Because im afaid of those ever fearful ant colonies making my helmet their new home I just use the D-rings to hang it from the left passenger peg... Off the ground and its not likely to slip off, either... The grooves on the peg prevent the D-ring from sliding...

As for dropping it 8 times and not replacing it... Hey its your head, I am not going to preach to you about it, but I think if you are spendning money on bike "upgrades" before replacing what is very likely a useless helmet, you have some seriously distorted priorities... Bike upgrades wont do you much good if you are a vegetable and can't ride it next season.


Thats right it is my head and its beautiful at that. :P

I have been in one bad wreck were I hit a deer and me and the bike went head over heels. I had a KBC on and didn't feel thing when it came to my head. I jumped right to my feet after the wreck so i didn't even get knocked out or anything. There was even a rubber mark on the helmet as if the tire from the bike hit me. So I trust my KBC. I think you are paying more for comfort than actual safety when it comes to KBC, HJC, Arai, etc...

As for putting the helmet down I do the same thing as Jeff. I place it on the back peg. I either flip up the visor and make sure the whole bottom mouth piece is over it or I put it on the D-Ring.

[Rev]

Thats right it is my head and its beautiful at that. :P

I have been in one bad wreck were I hit a deer and me and the bike went head over heels. I had a KBC on and didn't feel thing when it came to my head. I jumped right to my feet after the wreck so i didn't even get knocked out or anything. There was even a rubber mark on the helmet as if the tire from the bike hit me. So I trust my KBC. I think you are paying more for comfort than actual safety when it comes to KBC, HJC, Arai, etc...

As for putting the helmet down I do the same thing as Jeff. I place it on the back peg. I either flip up the visor and make sure the whole bottom mouth piece is over it or I put it on the D-Ring.


use and arai kbc...now force impact on the head harder then your fall...see which helmet will do your noggin better...lol...if kbc has good material as arai, why don't they sell thier lids for 400 each...not 100....not mocking you or what your said..i'm just stating a gay dumb opinion because i'm bored...

[Kaos]

use and arai kbc...now force impact on the head harder then your fall...see which helmet will do your noggin better...lol...if kbc has good material as arai, why don't they sell thier lids for 400 each...not 100....not mocking you or what your said..i'm just stating a gay dumb opinion because i'm bored...

well that makes 2 of us that are bored so here goes me supporting my gay dumb opinion. I said you pay the extra money for name and comfort. You will get less wind noise and it will be more comfortable (lighter) with an Arai vs a KBC but that doesn't mean one is safer than the other. Now if you want to test this theory then I am game. I will wear a KBC, you can wear an Arai and we will both jump off a ladder head first of course. But you go first. :D

[ffejtable]

Price does not mean anything, and you should all know that. A $250,000 Ferrari is no safer than a $12,000 Honda Civic. You are paying for speed and prestige, not safety. How about a pair of Jeans... You think those $200 Designer jeans are better than $40 Levis?

There was a rather extensive article written before about some of the reasons for the price difference, one being the number of different shell sizes each manufacturer uses... For example, a single universal shell size cuts production costs considerably. The bottom line of the article was that with the major brands, you are paying for comfort and not safety...

The quote below is from http://www.smf.org

What's the difference between this $100 Snell certified helmet and this $400 Snell certified Helmet.
While helmets are primarily a protective device, the true protective capabilities of a helmet will only come into play for about 2 to 4 milliseconds during the ownership of the helmet. This leaves a lot of time for that helmet to be doing nothing more than sitting around on a users head. The Snell standards do not measure factors like comfort, ventilation, brand recognition or style, and only indirectly look at fit, weight, materials and workmanship. These are factors that frequently drive helmet cost.

I am more than willing to trade a little comfort for $300 of my hard earned cash...

[PitsVtec]

I started something good here...huh?...now when my helmet fell off my bike...it landed on my shield... then bounced over and there is a tiny scratch on the back....would that call for replacement?

[ffejtable]

The bottom line is any impact on the helmet has the potential to damage it. There are too many factors to consider to give any reasonable answer on a forum like this. The height of the drop, the weight of the helmet, the location of the impact, etc, etc, etc.. The only way to know for sure is to have it inspected properly by the manufacturer who probably uses xray or mri technology to examine the integrity of the protective material.

Kinda has me wondering if I shouldnt use the helmet I had a mishap with at the track last year.. I did smack my good pretty hard... By the looks of it, you would never know, though.... But the most important protective part of the helmet the part you cant see...

Sigh...

[RonJ83]

i got a letter from Arai but i had deleted it by accident, but overall the rep that replied said that if i got it at a "authorized" arai dealer i can send it back to them and have them take a look. it was pretty much bullshit cause he didnt say whether or not i can continue using the helmet, but im guessing if they allow you to send it back to be inspected they can still be used in a minor drop?

[Cakes206]

it was pretty much bullshit cause he didnt say whether or not i can continue using the helmet

No way hes gonna give you that answer...its a liability issue on their part...if you ask him its ok to use, and he says yes, then you get into a wreck and end up having to eat pizza thru a straw the rest of yer life...it's their ass. Basically hes covering his by saying you can have it checked out...

[PitsVtec]

No way hes gonna give you that answer...its a liability issue on their part...if you ask him its ok to use, and he says yes, then you get into a wreck and end up having to eat pizza thru a straw the rest of yer life...it's their ass. Basically hes covering his by saying you can have it checked out...


True:nod2:

[ffejtable]

i got a letter from Arai but i had deleted it by accident, but overall the rep that replied said that if i got it at a "authorized" arai dealer i can send it back to them and have them take a look. it was pretty much bullshit cause he didnt say whether or not i can continue using the helmet, but im guessing if they allow you to send it back to be inspected they can still be used in a minor drop?

you wanted to know if the helmet was still safe.

the only way to know is to have it inspected, which the arai rep recommended you do.

what might be considered a MINOR impact by you may still have had major damage done to the protective foam inside.

no two falls are the same, and the only way to be sure if to get it inspected.

im confused why this concept is difficult for some to grasp..

you can not visually inspect a helmet and determine if its good.

you can not determine the amount of damage done be guessing how hard/serious the fall was. under some conditions im sure even the most innocent of impacts can cause serious damage...

[RCM78]

Aria will check the helmet. And if it's good they will tell you it's good and send a letter back to you stating that the helmet is good.

I failed a rider at tech last season cause his helmet was all scraped up. He produced a letter from Arai stating the helmet was tested and OK.

The only problem I had with it was the guy could crash with that helmet several times and keep using the same letter. Ultimately it wasnt my decision to pass the helmet...

[bikerguyzx12]

you guys keep comparing 600 dollar helmets to 200 dollar helmets as far as impact resistance, it goes alot further than that, the higher line helmets offer much better abrasion ressistance in a slide, not to mention adjustable padding for custom fitting, superior ventilation, better quality of elements which in turn makes the helmet lighter, and easier shield removal and more shield options (i.e. locking mechanisms and venting mechanisms. i have almost every "brand name" helmet ever made and at least one of every helmet that i sell in my shop and by far my shoei RF1000 is the best helmet i have ever used, i use it almost every time i ride, even over my 700 dollar arai, i pride myself in being somewhat of a helmet guru, if you guys have any questions than just call me, i can help u out with anything from what a specific helmet weighs to arodynamics of the helmet to helmet materials, give me a shout im always happy to help

D-ROK

732-906-9292 x1016

[njracer]

I'm not sure about Arai but my friend crashed on the track a few years back with a custom painted Shoie. He sent it in to get checked and they told him it was not safe anymore....he's like fine, just send it back so he can have a little memento of his highspeed Bridgehampton crash......Shoei was like sorry...we destroyed the helmet.

BTW - if you need a new lid check out the deal on the WERA board http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?t=105492

njracer

[voteforguy]

My previous Arai had been dropped off my bike at least 20 times easily. Sometimes from the seat, other times from the mirror stalk, and usually it had my gloves inside it.

When I got my new Arai, I sent the old one back to them to test it. The test was $10. They sent me back my helmet with a report. They said taht the helmet did not appear to be affected by the drops. However, there was an area of the styrofoam that was "compromised" due to hanging on the mirror stalk. They said that if I were wearing the helmet and I received an impact on that point, that the helmet would not be able to protect me the way it was designed. They recommended a replacement.

In all honesty, it was probably okay. I mean, what are the odds you'd land exactly on that one spot to absorb the impact? I ended up selling the old Arai anyway (it was a size too big for my head). And yes, I told the buyer exactly what Arai said about the helmet and he was fine with it.

[High_Revs_17]

what are the odds you'd land exactly on that one spot to absorb the impact?

Murphy's Law always seems to handle that situation very well.

[PitsVtec]

JEEZ....someone is waking the dead with posts....LOL....

[soda7o]

i wear a natzi helmet in chrome beaches that offers the best protection :)

[High_Revs_17]

DOT Approved Big German Motorcycle Helmet :crazy:
http://www.helmetsetc.com/detail.asp?product_id=bg_dot

http://www.helmetsetc.com/images/helmets/caliber/bgdot.jpg

i wear a natzi helmet in chrome beaches that offers the best protection :)

[soda7o]

fo sho fo sho

[sonny]

DOT Approved Big German Motorcycle Helmet :crazy:
http://www.helmetsetc.com/detail.asp?product_id=bg_dot

http://www.helmetsetc.com/images/helmets/caliber/bgdot.jpg

I always laugh at people that have those on.

[Cakes206]

i have almost every "brand name" helmet ever made and at least one of every helmet that i sell in my shop and by far my shoei RF1000 is the best helmet i have ever used, i use it almost every time i ride, even over my 700 dollar arai.

Your Shoei is probly designed better to fit to your head over the Arai. In the end, its not about the price of the helmet, but a proper fit.

[Rev]

you guys keep comparing 600 dollar helmets to 200 dollar helmets as far as impact resistance, it goes alot further than that, the higher line helmets offer much better abrasion ressistance in a slide, not to mention adjustable padding for custom fitting, superior ventilation, better quality of elements which in turn makes the helmet lighter, and easier shield removal and more shield options (i.e. locking mechanisms and venting mechanisms. i have almost every "brand name" helmet ever made and at least one of every helmet that i sell in my shop and by far my shoei RF1000 is the best helmet i have ever used, i use it almost every time i ride, even over my 700 dollar arai, i pride myself in being somewhat of a helmet guru, if you guys have any questions than just call me, i can help u out with anything from what a specific helmet weighs to arodynamics of the helmet to helmet materials, give me a shout im always happy to help

D-ROK

732-906-9292 x1016

I agree the shoei i love...i crashed in my arai and that shit gave me noggin a good bang up job...

[PitsVtec]

DOT Approved Big German Motorcycle Helmet :crazy:
http://www.helmetsetc.com/detail.asp?product_id=bg_dot

http://www.helmetsetc.com/images/helmets/caliber/bgdot.jpg

"Not a good idea helmet"